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How much major roof work costs please?
Has anyone got an idea of how much major roof work costs please? I’m in a horrible situation!
A bit of context: I’m in London and buying my first flat, nothing glamorous. Days away from exchanging, it was brought to my attention that the block is about to undergo major roof works (Section 20, awaiting quotes). The service charge is already high, and will get higher but no costs can/will be disclosed at this stage. I now have to renegotiate my offer but I don’t know what’s reasonable and what’s not, because I don’t know the extent of the work required.
Now, the estate agent: he told me I’m already getting the flat at a really good price, and the seller is really keen to exchange on Friday but she’s not open to offers – however, he would put one to her. The flat has been vacant since July and she really wants to sell it to me. She denied knowing anything about the Section 20, I only found out the other day! The estate agent told me a similar block had the same extensive work done for 480k; however, I went on a tradespeople FB page and they told me to expect 1.25m to 1.65m due to size and height of the building. The cost is to be split between 130 flats.
My question is therefore very broad… what do I do now? I’m due to move, then have major surgery. Once I undergo surgery, I won’t be able to move house for months. I might also get hit with stamp duty at that point. This property could have worked out so well, and getting a mortgage offer was incredibly tough too. I have already invested quite a bit in mortgage broker, solicotors and survey fees. I also have an eviction.
Can anyone please spare a word of advice?
EDIT:
Thank you so much you wonderful people! My solicotor is now asking the vendor to set aside a 15k fund to be made available over the next 5 years. Unfortunately, because there is no official figure and management won’t comment, it’s not possible for the vendor to pay for the work now. I am told this could take months or years. After all, if the vendor is so confident that it will only cost a couple of thousands per household… and the estate agent is suggesting I lower my offer only 2k… then the vendor will only have to fork out the same amount she would lower the price by anyway!
FINAL EDIT:
You lovely people have saved me more than you’ll ever know!
I was walking on eggshells trying not to be unreasonable but it turns out that my solicitor was crap, and the vendor was so out of touch she ended up putting the place back on the rental market as soon as I withdrew from the deal, knowing nobody else would buy it.
Thanks to you all I am now looking for a different place and a decent, honest and reliable seller. A legal firm was also recommended to me, so hopefully now the only way is up.
When I first got a coule of comments I thought your fears were perhaps excessive but I soon changed my mind and walked away from this deal. I will leave this post here even though is no longer relevant, in case it comes up in someone else’s search. The decision I took was tough, withdrawing on the day I should have exchanged has left me really deflated but I would do it again and encourage anyone in my position to do the same.
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21 Replies
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I sympathise with your situation – you have a number of things going on. I pulled out of a transaction for exactly the same reason, a s.20 was served in a large block of flats I was buying in and the quotes has not yet been received and therefore I didn’t know what my financial contribution would be. The process will take a few months yet as the landlords have to follow the process to the letter of the law. Your seller should take a logical approach because if you don’t buy the flat, then the s.20 will hold up any future sale with someone else. Best not to be pressurised into an exchange when you don’t have all the facts and cost implications.
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I think I’d knock on some neighbouring doors and ask them the background to the roof issue and what they’ve known and when. The seller had a duty of care to pass on that information – there’s no way they didn’t know. Then I’d make a lower offer accordingly. As others say, the estate agent wants their commission so it’s not in their interest for the sale to fall through or the price to go down. But I’m sure the seller would hate the sale to collapse at this stage too and would be forced to negotiate if you didn’t appear to be in the worst situation. I certainly wouldn’t move forward without knowing the cost. An AirBnB would be cheaper post-eviction than a huge bill you weren’t expecting. And if they both know that’s your position, your negotiating position becomes stronger.
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I would not listen ever to the “you’re getting it at a good price” comment he is not impartial and has no incentive but to close the deal. It’s done to send you into panic but as it is your first flat I assume you are not in a chain or can you focus on staying put while this is resolved? I would take the sense of urgency out of this as any potential buyer is going to come up against this. Try and hold your nerve on this as this is easily where things wobble and people make rash decisions to jump without all the information.
Since Section 20 work is complex and costly, it’s completely reasonable to need a closer cost estimate. If no quotes are available, the freeholder or managing agent should at least provide an estimate range based on similar projects in your area. You can ask if there’s a consultant overseeing the project who might give you insights. What I don’t want is anyone withholding information from you, which can legally happen because you’re accepting the risk. Its completely unreasonable that they will not disclose costs because of the stage you are at and you are within your rights to say, I will await the costs on this issue, as much as any buyer will wait for the costs on an issues that comes up in the survey that requires work.
If the cost estimate for a similar building’s work was between £1.25 million and £1.65 million, and it’s split among 130 flats, you’re potentially looking at between roughly £9,600 and £12,700 per flat. If the previous similar project cost £480,000, that would put your share closer to £3,700.
Given that this is major work, you could reasonably negotiate the price down to account for a significant portion of your expected share of the costs. This might offset some future financial strain from the increased service charges and the Section 20 contribution. Even if the seller is reluctant, a well-reasoned approach—of exactly these facts is entirely reasonable leverage. The only question of taking the hit is if you had a potentially costly reason to move in quickly that will otherwise cost you.
Given that Section 20 work was not disclosed initially, I would ask your solicitor whether this might impact the agreement, especially if the seller had prior knowledge. I would expect the solicitor to present all these points on your behalf as you have without any doubt cause for concern.
Hope that helps give you some guidance, let us know what you think and how things go.
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The building doesn’t have a reserve fund for these types of major works? The building’s freeholder/management company should be able to tell you that, and say if they would make payment plans available. Their contact info should be in the seller’s disclosure packet. If not, I think what you have to ask yourself is do you have the cash to pay for the works in the next few months? At the high end of those price points, the bill would be 12.5K for one flat, which is a lot in the absolute but not outrageous for major works – which could hit you unexpectedly in any building, even if not right away.
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I can’t offer advice either way, I guess it would depend how much I really wanted the place. But don’t forget, the management company will increase the bills to cover the extra costs but will they actually reduce them again?
Can you ask if there is a sinking fund? This is money collected and set aside for big projects like this.
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I had a section 20 in my last flat while selling, my solicitor and the buyers wrote it in the contract that I paid for the work before exchange. I paid £9,000 and that was 8 years ago. Personally, I would not purchase until you have seen the section 20, I would ask neighbours, and I would not just be be lowering my offer, I would expect all of the work paid for before I sign anything. Estate agents are trying to make money, the quicker the sale the better for them. I’m afraid they are not there to help you financially!! They just want their commissions. Please really think carefully about the flat and if you really want to take on something of this scale of cost. You also mention high service costs, these have a huge impact and if they are rising I expect you will struggle to sell in the future. The fact that it’s been empty for a long time is quite telling!
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Just wait. No one else is likely to buy at this stage so you can sit tight till the cost is known and make an offer then. You will have a better idea but I’ve heard of roof costs topping £50k each.
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Have you exchanged contracts ?
I would be suspicious of the vendor not being aware of this works…. Normally these sort of things are in the pipeline for a long time and discussed at building mgmt meetings for a long time
I would be contacting the mgmt company of the building and see if they can help with your questions…
If you find out how long they have been aware of this for that may help with your decision.
I personally would be treading with caution and perhaps pulling out…. Unless you have that sort of money lying around to pay for it ? What if you are hit with a bill of £10K ? Do you have a plan for that senario ?
Also might be worth having an ask to see the building mgmt accounts to see what’s in the fund and how much they plan to pay towards the repairs.
Good luck
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I have a flat and all works to communal or estate areas are discussed and thoroughly put out to tender and then chosen by the board and residents duly noted of the cost . This vendor is clearly trying to pull a fast one . The estate agent doesn’t care and just wants the commission.
I would be tempted to ask some of the residents in the block as to what’s been agreed etc and reduce the offer accordingly. I’d also do some research on the management company too. We as joint owners have a board and employ an external company and things are run very well but many blocks are not .
I hope you get this resolved but please be cautious
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I have been in an almost identical situation and it did NOT work out well for me… major works were complete when I purchased and estimated final sum per house (similar sized building by the look of it) was £15,200. The vendors set aside that sum for me. Housing association took 5 years to produce final bill despite MUCH communication from me. Final bill came in at £21k. Fortunately the £15,200 was still available to me but the remaining £6k I had to fork out for. If it takes longer than 5y to produce the bill (bearing in mind they’re at a very early stage of major works) am I right in thinking the money would no longer be set aside for you? I’d honestly walk away.
Also based in London (a housing association called poplar harca in tower hamlets)
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would run away, as fast as my legs could carry me. Also, an estate agent is no friend to buyer or seller, they are simply sales folk who want their easy commission, never believe a word they say, only believe legal documentaion that would count in a court. Best of luck.
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Like others have said including the ever marvellous Tom, I personally would absolutely not exchange until you know at least expected costs and I think anyone asking you to do anything else is whole unreasonable. Is your solicitor advocating you exchange on that basis, because surely that is not ok either, and would your mortgage provider forward the mortgage also not knowing how much these repairs will be?
Def estate agents are there to put pressure on everyone to get the sale completed and them saying the buyer really wants to sell the flat to you is entire BS – neither them or the vendor care who buys it.
I would say you’re on hold with the whole process until the vendor can obtain expected costs (as also you shouldn’t have to run around trying to work these out, it’s not your responsibility or quite frankly your problem, it’s the vendor’s) and then the vendor should pay for them/give you the equivalent funds/reduce the sales price as the flat is still their property atm. There are so many flats, you presumably have a mortgage offer, don’t let them panic you into anything though I appreciate you will have spent some money on legal fees etc to get to this stage but losing that is much the lesser evil than the other possible alternative.
Hold your nerve!!!
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When I purchased a leasehold, one of the contractual points added by my solicitor was to make any s20 demand made within 18mons of completion that the seller had been made aware of would be the responsibility of the seller. When I moved in 12mons later came a 3k demand for roof repairs and thankfully I just sent the bill to the solicitor and it was paid. Discuss this option with your solicitor as it would enable you to still exchange but reduce the burden on you – particularly as the seller was aware of the notice and didn’t disclose (the dates of s20 notices will be in the management pack)
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I don’t know if you’re able to clarify this, and sorry I’m being a bit slow but are you talking about instruction form to her solicitors or to the estate agent?
The estate agent is now trying to convince her to accept the retainer against her solicitors advice and I should expect a response tomorrow. I’m trying to get my facts right before I challenge them. It feels like my solicitor is not giving me the advice he’s been paid to give me… I’m having to tell him what to do! If it wasn’t for you, I wouldn’t have even known about potential additional clauses such as this!
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No it’s about the seller pack she completed – her solicitor should have explained to her very clearly she must disclose anything she is aware of in the questionnaire (the TA7 form) I’m not sure how she can claim she wasn’t aware of two separate s20 notices but if she was confused if it should have been on there, she could have asked for clarification.
It’s weird how few people know about the option – I had an excellent conveyancer years ago who did that in the contract, but have met so many people who weren’t as lucky. It’s such a simple solution to sort things out now, obviously it may be hard to find the £ for her, but if they don’t call for the money within the time frame agreed, then she gets it back.
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I understand. However, her solicitors will argue that they didn’t hide it from me. They did pass on these papers to mine, I just found out upon receiving contract and other documents, days before the exchange was due to take place. I’m not sure I can kick off at this point, I just think she should have been honest with the estate agent before I appointed a conveyancer… because I would have looked into costs back in June, when I first enquired about the property.
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Agree but also that TA7 form is handed to your solicitors very early doors so they could have flagged it then instead of waiting till the pack arrived. It’s a shame as in reality it’s going to cost her the same finding another buyer, not to mention you losing out on the process as well
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I’ll find out tomorrow what she decides to do but yes, it’s costing her quite a bit and she could potentially end up selling in another 6 months. Not only the uncertainty, but I had to postpone my cancer surgery in order to move into the new place and have a comfortable recovery.
I just didn’t realise how sh*t my solicitor was!! I will definitely quiz him tomorrow. You are so knowledgeable and I’m ever so grateful for the time you have spent advising me
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oh that’s awful for you to have to go through this. I wish I could recommend the solicitor I used but no idea what happened to her after my purchase as I did try to use her again but she had left the firm and that was at least 10yrs ago. I did use The Partnership Limited on another transaction and they were pretty knowledgeable about solutions so maybe if this falls through, when you find your perfect place, worth speaking to them? Everything is crossed for you
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I just came off the phone. I offered 365k (down from the agreed 380k and a leaky window on me!) and she refused. She will keep letting it, probably having to replace the velux too. I took a real offence to her stubborness and arrogance.
Please may I message you privately to thank you for your help?
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