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Advice about architectural plans and structural drawings
I would really appreciate your guidance in terms of architectural plans, structural drawings, CDM Regs and next steps please. We are confused!
We are in the process of getting quotes to remodel the layout of our downstairs (internal only – no extension). In terms of the design, we:
1. Initially instructed an architect, who carried out a measured survey and provided us with several potential plans.
2. We were undecided on which direction to go so we then enlisted the help of a designer (described as a “freelance concept planner”) who worked with us over the course of a week to refine and finalise the plan.
Through subsequent discussions with several builders who are preparing to quote, we decided on several tweaks to the layout – and have finally reached a point where we know exactly what we want! Where we’ve ended up is basically somewhere in between the architect’s plan and the designer’s plan, hence the dilemma we now face….
We need a few structural calculations and drawings doing in respect of one steel beam and two lintels that we’re likely to need. We’ve had fee proposals from two structural engineers for this work and they are both:
1. first requesting “design frozen 1:50 Architects plans and sections” / “frozen architectural building regulation drawings”, and
2. stating that under the CDM 2015 Regulations, they will not be the Principal Designer.
What should we do now? None of the plans we have from either the architect or the designer quite reflect what we want (albeit some are very similar). Do we now need to go back to the architect (or instruct an architectural designer) to draw exactly what we want before a structural engineer can/will act?
I was previously under the impression that we wouldn’t necessarily require the services of an architect for our project at all, although we nevertheless chose to enlist one originally. Was this correct? If so, is it the norm for structural engineers to ask for finalised architects’ drawings in respect of internal structural alterations or not?
Also, in this situation, who would usually act as the Principal Designer?
Many thanks in advance for any words of wisdom.
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6 Replies
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A few questions here, would you be able to share the plans as you are remodelling internally or just to understand you are re-working a downstairs layout including moving, altering or removing structural walls?
Personally I would assume the architect would have provided you with a quote that allowed for some iterations and I would have seen the designer as an intermediary second opinion who influenced the final plans. I would get the architect (they provide you with more assurance and security if they draw up the plans) to provide the detailed drawings next so you have a clear and accurate final set of plans for the structural engineers to work from.
A final set is paramount and even though planning permission may not have been required for your project you are likely to still have to involve building control who will also want a final set of detailed drawings with all the structural calculations on.
Personally I would want the architect to act as the principal designer even if they didn’t present the final solution. By providing and completing the final drawing for you they will also check everything is feasible that you have finalised and then adhere to those drawings. The detailed drawings will let you plan plumbing, electrics and any insulation or underfloor heating e.t.c. that you are planning to encompass too.
As for employing an architect if its a considerable internal layout change the I don’t see why one wouldn’t employ them and more so if you have structural wall changes and for example are moving the kitchen from one end of the property to another for example they will test to the feasibility of that better than anyone.
Hope that makes sense as a start.
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hank you so much for taking the time to write such a detailed response .
I haven’t got the plans to hand right now (will try to add later!) but most of what we’re looking to do is not structural – for example putting up a couple of stud walls to recreate the original lounge and hallway, adding an understairs WC, moving the boiler and utility room to a different area, replacing the kitchen (with a different layout but in the same part of the house).
The structural elements are:
– creating an additional opening in a main structural wall to create a small snug room off the kitchen
– widening the opening at the back of the house to replace French doors with sliding doors across the width of the back
We will indeed need building control sign-off. I had been under the impression that the structural engineer would do the drawings for this but perhaps I was mistaken?
Although the architect hasn’t been involved for some time – and we paid for his first few iterations on an hourly rate basis – it sounds like the best course of action will still be to ask him to draw up the final set of drawings?
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yes I think for peace of mind and to ensure professional competency is carried out I would use the original architect as they also surveyed the property and ask them to complete final detailed drawings of your design to submit to the structural survey.
The Architects Registration Board (ARB) regulates the architects’ profession in the UK to ensure that good standards of conduct and practice are consistently maintained and therefore I would feel more protected having them do the plans over anyone!
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From legal perspective, use the architect and ask them to move the original plans toward where you want to “freeze” them (as correctly put). “Concept planner” hopeless as not a recognised profession / insurance. Structural engineer v important and will be used to working with another professional ie the arch. Arch will be PD under CDM (quite normal for SE not to be). The builder will be the PC. I can help you set up /check you’ve set up contract network properly.
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Just to add to the above – we had a simple load bearing wall removal and the structural engineer provided drawings and beam calculations after their visit, we did not have an architect at all. We used this for building control.
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I would also ensure whoever is doing the building works has the necessary contacts to support you. I’m having an extension built and my builder has liaised with building inspector, structural engineer, water board etc. This was included in the price. They do this every day so if they are decent will have the required connections.
I would go back to your architect and adjust the plans, I did this 3 times, and after planning was approved my builder liaised with the planning department and building inspector on any small changes.
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